I need to build a newer computer

[Cat Ion]

This is what I currently have:

http://www.vprmatrix.com/products_desktop_226R.asp

I've since upgraded it to 1G RAM, dual 120G HDD, Soundblaster Live, GeForce 5700LE, DVD-ROM and DVD-RW drives. Works great, but some of the new games have minimum requirements past my computer on all levels now. So it's official that it's ancient.

I want to build a new one to play the newer games and survive for a little while without making any huge upgrades soon after it's built, but I also don't want to sell my first born to afford it. I was looking at a mid tower case with 650W power supply, Core 2 Duo board around 3Ghz with 2G memory, GeForce 8600 series with 512M ram on board, dual WD HDD's for redundancy and file protection and maybe a Soundblaster Audigy (unless someone suggests otherwise). I was figuring under $1000 to make this work. Am I way off-base? I found someone on eBay that has assembled computer packages for buyers. He's rated at 99.6% and has over 2900 sales. So I'm comfortable using him. He quoted this setup with it fully built and including a full version of XP Home included for $1100 + $49 shipped. Would I be better off building it myself? I know there's a couple of you computer guys in here that can offer some input. I'm open to it. Any help is welcome.

[bc3tech]

honestly man the price he gave you isn't far off from what you could get from a company like dell, etc. the only reasons i went w/ dell is
1) i had a coupon fro $350 off
2) i am behind on the technology at this point
3) i wanna blame somebody when shit goes wrong :)

i'd check your local stores too, who knows maybe they have a config that suits you perfectly and at a good price w/ the holidays coming up. *shrug*

As far as specs go, here's what i'd recommend, being as generic as possible:
a dual-core CPU. a must for computing nowadays. nobody single-tasks anymore, and more and more apps & games are being built to take advantage of the true multiprocessing - i'm partial to AMD, but the proof's out there that the Core2 is a better performer (right now). The GHz won't matter as much on a dual-core chip as much as it did on single-core ones.
2gb RAM - Vista damn near requires it.
SATA hard drives - look for 10k RPM ones if possible. cuts down on lag time when files are hitting the disk.
hopefully that helps somewhat.

[Cat Ion]

Can you elaborate on the dual core capabilities vs. single core? I understand that my 2.26Ghz is one processor and a dual core has two processors, but in my application, if I bought a dual core @2.26Ghz is each core 2.26 or is it split equally? I'm trying to grasp the necessity for dual core. I've seen some quad cores out there too.

[bc3tech]

Can you elaborate on the dual core capabilities vs. single core? I understand that my 2.26Ghz is one processor and a dual core has two processors, but in my application, if I bought a dual core @2.26Ghz is each core 2.26 or is it split equally? I'm trying to grasp the necessity for dual core. I've seen some quad cores out there too.
quad cores are becoming more and more prevalent however the "average" user doesn't need them. most gamers don't even need them.

a dual core at X.XXGHz means each core runs at that speed, however, that does NOT mean that you're getting X.XX * 2 for speed, that's actually a physical impossibility. Rather, it's more like X.XX * 1.5 at the most, if i remember my theories right. somebody feel free to dig up all the numbers there, but that's what i recall from way back when ppl had two separate chips on boards & shit.

The only *real* benefit a dual core gives you is the ability to truly multitask. so, if you aren't one to do a lot of things at once, you actually won't see much improvement over a single-core machine. On the other hand, however, all those anti-virus / spyware / adware programs are always running in the background, so some users do report some improvement in "everyday" computer usage w/ a dual core machine.
it's basically like having two people doing the work instead of one person trying to do as much as they can at the same time.

dual cores have largely become the "norm" because manufacturers realized they were approaching the practical and financially responsible limit of putting transistors on a silicon die.

[Cat Ion]

So if I'm looking at a dual core 2.4, it should in theory perform better than a single core 3.0?

[bc3tech]

So if I'm looking at a dual core 2.4, it should in theory perform better than a single core 3.0?
depends on what you're doing. if you're doing multiple things at the same time, or have a lot of stuff that runs in the background, yes. if you're doing just one thing, probably not.

also something else to keep in mind - like many systems, a computer is only as fast as the slowest thing in it. so it's important that you try and keep everything on the same "level" or else you're wasting your money somewhere.

ie: don't get a 700mb SLI set of vid cards, then use 1gb RAM in the comp... etc

[Cat Ion]

I'm mainly looking for the ability to play the newer games without any real hangups and don't want to be forced to upgrade less than a year later. That's all. I don't write code or anything like that. I just don't want to start building and be using outdated formats.

[bc3tech]

I'm mainly looking for the ability to play the newer games without any real hangups and don't want to be forced to upgrade less than a year later. That's all. I don't write code or anything like that. I just don't want to start building and be using outdated formats.
such is the game homie.

if you're looking at gaming, just go w/ a solid core2 duo... 2.4ghz+, 2gb ram, a 512 vid card, and 10k sata drives. that'll set you up for a while.

[Cat Ion]

I guess that's the angle I'm gonna take. Thanks for the input! I'll post up later when I get it on order or whatever. I did look at Best Buy and they don't package a good computer for anywhere near what the eBay seller could make. They had a core 2 duo @2.4Ghz, 1 GhzRAM, 256Mhz video RAM, 10/100 card, proprietary sound, 500G HDD @7200 spin for $1400. I can do better for $400 less.

[bc3tech]

I guess that's the angle I'm gonna take. Thanks for the input! I'll post up later when I get it on order or whatever. I did look at Best Buy and they don't package a good computer for anywhere near what the eBay seller could make. They had a core 2 duo @2.4Ghz, 1 GhzRAM, 256Mhz video RAM, 10/100 card, proprietary sound, 500G HDD @7200 spin for $1400. I can do better for $400 less.
yeah retail stores can't really compete anymore... but dell did good for me, aside from the ridiculous delays and horrible customer service, that is. let me know how it works out for ya.

i don't recommend dell per se, just something along the lines of a custom build-to-order PC as it's becoming less and less cost & headache effective to build your own anymore it seems.

[FunkyStickman]

I've built computers for years. That's a good deal for what you're getting. Have fun with it!

[bc3tech]

I just posted a story about AMD's quad core in the codeproject insider thread (http://www.eatoninside.com/showthread.php?p=4886#post4886)

[Cat Ion]

It is on order now through Newegg.com

CoolerMaster Mid tower
2 case fans
Gigabyte P35 ATX board
Intel Core 2 Duo E6550
Thermaltake 120mm CPU Cooler
GeForce 8600GT PCIe
Mushkin 2 X 1G memory
Thermaltake 500W power supply
WD 80G 7200 spin (X2) SATA
WD 250G 7200 spin SATA
22" Widescreen LCD
USB Mouse
USB keyboard
Lite-On SATA DVD+/-R Burner w/ lightscribe
Asus SATA DVD-ROM drive
XP Home w/ SP2

Out the door w/ shipping for $1400

[JayCizzo]

That sounds like a pretty kick ass computer to me. Enjoy!

[bc3tech]

not bad. as long as u don't max out the RAM u won't see too much of a hit w/ those 7200rpm drives. but if you start pegging that RAM u'll wanna upgrade the drives to avoid getting raped by the pagefile.

nice pickup tho.

the same i paid for my dell with 500gb, amd 64x2 5600, one dvd+/-rw drive, 256mb 8600GT, vista, 3yr mcafee (i got 22in widescreen too :)), 1yr service, and roxio premier media creation thing. :)

[Cat Ion]

I had considered getting 10K spin HDD's but they are freakishly expensive at the moment. The board supposedly supports 8G. Not needed anytime soon!

[Cat Ion]

Got it built about a week ago. Running into a problem with a couple games. The computer in itself is working fine. I like first person shooters. I really like the Medal of Honor series. I installed MOH Allied Assault. Works fine. Went to install the expansion pack Spearhead and Breakthrough and they require a patch 1.11 from EA games. So it installs it. Must have it to move on. Now none of the three work. I uninstalled and reinstalled MOHAA and it works fine. Reinstalled the two expansions and it crashes again. MOHAA crashes as the game itself is loading up. It gives me a Microsoft error report. Can't copy it to show anyone what went wrong. The other two crash halfway through startup and go to the desktop with no error on the screen. Emailed EA and they give me the everloving runaround. They automatically want to tell me I need to update my drivers, direct X, etc. They are as current as possible since this was custom built and I had to go to the motherboard website, along with the video card website to get the latest drivers for each device. Hmm.......not sure what to make of this. They all three worked on my older computer. I also loaded Quake 3 on the new computer and it works fine maxed out on all settings.

[Mikeyredline]

May I chime in from a technical stand-point?

Disregarding 10K gaedrives and 3GHZ processors... Building a compy is like building a car. You do not want to be all dressed up with a Huge engine, and you can't keep the rubber on the road. Generally since most u-proc run way faster that anuthing else in your... You need it to talk to things appropriately. Drop some serious coin on Ram and a Motherboard. Those are you buggest gating items in regards to speed. You should look at something aith a 1.2Ghz FSB, and at least 4GB of ram. Espically for gaming. Look at a small, fast HD next using an external for piccies n' stuff. Make sure you get the fasters video card you can for the coin, NOT NECCESARILY the one with the most on board ram. Also 2 slightly less cards used together with yeild 1.414 times the power, so choose carefully. Remember data is like exhaust, the faster you move it through, the better. Lastly PS qualty is more important than PS power. If you "need" 400W, there is no need for a 700W supply. Spend the xtra cost and get a really good 500W supply with low ripple, or else the effectiveness of a 700W supply may only be 400W.

Just some things I have learned along the way. I buitl a gamimg macine 3 yeas ago using these principals and to this day I can run just about anything state-of-the art. Good Luck!!!!

[XeroState]

All I have to add is make sure your video card is made by EVGA for Nvidia cards. And if you are SERIOUS about gaming, get a Power Supply and Mobo that can handle SLI and get 2 EVGA video cards [they MUST be the exact same card to run SLI].

The mobo you have listed is a great single card mobo, but isn't all that great for a dual card-SLI applications. If you want to go the SLI route I suggest getting the evga 680i A1 edition [discontinued, could be hard to find] or wait until they launch their 780i board.

[bc3tech]

All I have to add is make sure your video card is made by EVGA for Nvidia cards. And if you are SERIOUS about gaming, get a Power Supply and Mobo that can handle SLI and get 2 EVGA video cards [they MUST be the exact same card to run SLI].

The mobo you have listed is a great single card mobo, but isn't all that great for a dual card-SLI applications. If you want to go the SLI route I suggest getting the evga 680i A1 edition [discontinued, could be hard to find] or wait until they launch their 780i board.

personally i prefer BFG cards. Lifetime "no questions asked" warranty on them. i've had two replaced by them and they were awesome to work with each time. the cards got beat up on quite a bit so it wasn't much their fault

[TheWastedYears]

The board supposedly supports 8G. Not needed anytime soon!
Not on a 32 bit processor.

[Cat Ion]

I say again...the board will support it. I guess you're referring to the Core 2 not cabable of it. Sure, but I didn't buy it with the intent to go up that far yet. Basically I have a lot of room to expand later. I beieve that I was told that nothing over 4Gig RAM is necessary since the OS's out right now won't recognize more than that.

[Mikeyredline]

I say again...the board will support it. I guess you're referring to the Core 2 not cabable of it. Sure, but I didn't buy it with the intent to go up that far yet. Basically I have a lot of room to expand later. I beieve that I was told that nothing over 4Gig RAM is necessary since the OS's out right now won't recognize more than that.

Looks like you are well on your way, no?


Yeah, the 4Gig of ram thing is true. It is useless. Fucking PC :cursin:

[Cat Ion]

Done already. Works fine as far as I can tell. I had to pack it up to ship it to Korea since I leave in 3 weeks. But that's gonna get me through the next year.

[TheWastedYears]

I beieve that I was told that nothing over 4Gig RAM is necessary since the OS's out right now won't recognize more than that.
It's not an OS problem. It's a problem w/ 32 bit architecture.

32 bit OS's and apps can only handle 4GB (b/c of memory address length) and Windows XP/Vista will actually show closer to 3.5GB if 4GB is installed.

64 bit can handle more. However, both the OS and the ap must be 64 bit, or the same memory address limitation applies.

And actually.... 2GB is given to the kernel, so your apps are left only sharing the remaining 2-ish GB, unless you start Windows w/ the /3 switch, thus giving apps 3GB and kernel 1GB. (Use at your own risk)

[Cat Ion]

Another update! I know, old thread. But I made a change with a friend's advice. I upgraded to the EVGA 8800GT. He did a sie-by-side comparo between the 512Mb 8600GT and the 512Mb 8800GT and the throughput on the 8800 was double the 8600. Call of Duty 4 played at maximum settings with ZERO clipping period! I'm astounded by this card. Very impressive!